Brexit (The return of....)


#1083

Lame


#1084

Watching the Labour party conference & they are discussing Brexit.


#1085

No votes though, presumably?

I don’t think anyone suggested that there wouldn’t be some form of discussion, although it won’t be long before the Momentum Blackshirts stifle that dialogue as well.


#1086

Is Emily Thornberry trying to become Victoria Wood reincarnated?


#1087

:rofl::rofl:


#1088

From the BBC:

The Jeremy Corbyn-supporting Momentum group had urged its members not to support a resolution on Brexit, emailing them with an alternative list of subjects to choose

Why?

Also:


#1089

Momentum and its growth is really interesting. It shows how a small, focused group really can hijack politics from the mainstream, as the mainstream tend to be fairly apathetic. I think that politics worldwide is being moved to becoming a battle between the extremes, and I’m not sure what can be done to stop this.


#1090

Also from the New Statesman:

A Momentum figure suggested that the decision to avoid divisive issues
was a mark of the left’s maturity and its desire to win (New Labour
would similarly sideline controversial debates). “We shouldn’t give
ourselves the problems of government when we don’t have the advantages
of it,” a party insider told me.

Seems fair enough to me. What’s the problem?


#1091

They should go home then, since the other 8 subjects they chose are also the government’s problem.

What a crock of shite.


#1092

That it’s utter bollocks.

The biggest issue facing the country in generations and basically they want to pretend it’s not happening because it might be difficult and divisive. That’s real leadership right there, lol.

FFS.


#1093

Just in case anyone is under the illusion that Labour isn’t in the grip of some weird cult.


#1094

Just left as opposed to right.

We’re all fucked.


#1095

Didn’t ask about the Tories. I asked about how does Corbyn hiding from the issue and letting the country go to ruin in any way constitute leadership. Your response to criticise the other mob isn’t really a response so I assume you don’t have one.


#1096

Meanwhile, a musical interlude…


#1097

FFS


#1098

It’s showing political nous.
You are the opposition party, and the party in power has unleashed a total clusterfuck, a toxic waste dump of a change to how the country is both governed and seen on the world stage. But, they’ve been in power long enough for them to totally own whatever shambles this slides into, and they are ineffective and divided.

The toxicity extends not only through society, where strongly held opinions have divided friends and family, but to political parties, where differing opinions destroy unity. Meanwhile times change, and a majority of the country now no longer wants this change, as they realise not only will it be disastrous, but they were either conned into voting for it, or voted for it out of a misplaced sense of disenfranchisement.

The party in power has form for blaming your party retrospectively for the country’s financial ills, particularly 2008, even though it was largely their party’s backers and donors who were responsible, and as the same backers and donors control the conventional media, this view, despite being at odds with facts, largely holds sway. You decide the smart option is to wait it out, minimise exposure to the toxicity, and let the party in power have it’s way. After all, in a decade you don’t want some post truth toss sticking to you about this.

You do have a minimal influence, as in getting a two year extension to the negotiating process, but you’re careful to keep this very much at arms length. Your leader, who has massively increased membership and the party’s polling during his tenure seems to be making smart and effective decisions, and one of the smartest is to be seen to be putting minimal input into this – policy, debate, opinion as low as possible. It is guaranteed to be divisive and toxic by association, so minimise engagement and watch it fuck the tories.

The ideal scenario would, of course be for the tories to implode, new referendum and in like Flynn. And I maintain this is now more likely than the tories pulling brexit off.
Pulling themselves off, yes, but not brexit.


#1099

Playing politics while the country burns? It’s not political nous, it’s the sign of a party that will never get into office, and indeed doesn’t even want to. They’d rather protest.

It’s a one-shot deal - once we leave the EU, there’s no going back for a generation. It’s not the same as normal politics, where any policies can simply be reversed when you’re back in office.

It’s the single most important thing that has happened in UK politics for my while adult life, and the official Labour policy is not to debate it.

I’d like to think that the worst political event by a party I supported was Clegg romping in the garden with Cameron, but I think this may have outdone even that.


#1100

This


#1101

But but but, discussing re-arranging the deckchairs on the Titanic is how true leaders demonstrate their political acumen. Just don’t talk about how to stop it sinking, that’s someone else’s fault/problem.


#1102

You just described Jeremy Corbyn’s entire life story from the age of 19.