Hi all, any Tribute, Slagle, Townshend, etc passive preamps anyone wants to let go, or is willing to demo - want to try them with analog source, and with low watt valve amps
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I have a Slagle in a plastic box, and a naked Tribute which I haven’t yet put in a box.
@keith1962 recently put the Slagle up against his Tribute and couldn’t hear any difference afair
I think the Townsend and the icOn 5 may have solid state buffers built in, but I may also be remembering that incorrectly.
I have generally found TVCs and AVCs sound best when driven with a low impedance source, for example Thomas Mayer tends to sit the AVC after the step down transformer in his line stages. If you have a high output impedance source, you may be better off with the Townsend/icOn approach.
I like the Mayer 10y amp and that’s definitely my favourite tubed preamp to beat.
That said I want to audition AVCs with good records. Good records have a lot of information on them, like soundstage, tone etc, and it is better to let the record through. With digital and poor records it is required to have the audio research ref 10SE type soundstage.
I therefore actually want to try the AVCs and see if they work well against the Mayer 10y, which I have access to.
I did find that the Hattor did not do well against Kondo M7, so want to try something else
What is your definition of high output and low output impedance source. How much impedance are you thinking, from the phono
I have a Slagle silver AVC that I use with both vinyl and digital feeding one of Simon’s “low power” valve amps. It’s very transparent. I’ve lent it to Sami at the moment so maybe fly up to visit him and hear it there? He’s had it for just over a week so I’m interested to hear his views as he has heard more preamps in recent years than I have.
I should say I also have one of Simon’s older preamps which is also really good with a slightly richer sound.
Although I hadn’t thought about it before I think I agree with Simon that adding a buffer to the AVC would bring the best out of it. However I would prefer it to be valve rather than solid state based (I’m biased!) perhaps one of the miniature valves Simon uses in his preamps?
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As a quick follow up I’d also suggest listening to one of Simon’s recent preamps driving his power amps. I’ve heard several of Thomas’s amps/preamps at his workshop from the most basic up to the megabucks silver differential and though I was impressed with them I think Simon’s amps are competitive with them though he is much too modest to say so. However Thomas’s amps do look very nice and the way he builds them appeals to the engineer in me.
Simon may also be persuaded to build you a preamp using buffered silver AVC’s if asked nicely (heavy hint Simon)?
Lastly I should say that Dave Slagle’s comments on silver versus copper AVC’s are spot on. Copper AVC’s sound wonderful when you first hear them, hard to image anything better. Then you hear the silver AVC’s and the copper ones sound very coloured and less dynamic in comparison. I was very sceptical until I tried them both, I’d love to know why this is but have just come to accept it, at least with Dave’s AVC’s. Others may be different of course.
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Ouch (But true) I’m using the Copper Emia.
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Matt, sorry I must send you those images I promised. I’ll try to do it at the weekend!
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My phono stages and DACs have SE triode outputs without feedback, so tend to have an output impedance in the region of 1 kOhm to 2.5 kOhm, I would say this is quite high, but not particularly a problem unless you want long interconnects or use a low impedance input to the next amp
Many DACs and phono amps will use some form of low impedance buffer on the output, such as a cathode follower on valve amps or possibly step down transformers, and these will tend to give output impedance below 600 Ohms, and often well below 100 Ohms in solid state amps.
Thomas Mayer uses the step down transformer between the valve and AVC to drive the AVC with low impedance, and also to reduce self noise form the 10Y. It is a nice solution.
Any compare against the Mayer 10Y preamp you will need to be conscious that the output of the phono stage will have an influence over the total result. It doesn’t mean that one is better than the other, rather than one is more suitable for driving the AVC in that combination than the other.
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I haven’t heard a Slagle silver AVC, but have heard several Consolidated Audio SUTs with copper or silver wire, with either permalloy or nano crystal cores, and tend to find the copper ones offer richer tone, bigger structure and a more organic feel, whilst the silver ones may be a little lighter in feel, but have an effortless and ethereal quality which really captivates.
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As @sjs says up thread, I borrwed his Slagle and compared to my Tribute and there is nothing discernable between the two when swapping. Both units are copper internally. Simon covers the difference between copper and silver which is a personal preference thing really. Better for your wallet if you happen to prefer copper!
My unit was built up into a case with three inputs and two outputs by Pieter. He does do built up units but does not seem to advertise the fact.
It is very nice indeed but it is currently sitting on the subs bench due to an SJS Model 7 more than holding its own in the first team.
That could be a lot of fun
I’ll send you my Slagle silver AVC to listen to at some point - it was revelatory for me but as said up thread very damaging for my wallet! With the benefit of hindsight it might have been better not to have heard it.
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yeah, I have a list of those things as well, including silver foil caps, silver wired chokes and P&G faders
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